do you know what the symbol is called that has the Star of David, the menorah, and the Jesus fish is called?

Not until you asked and I looked it up! Thanks for the education.

	Misfit wrote:
	Not until you asked and I looked it up! Thanks for the education.

throw me a bone, what's it called? Did you learn something special about it?

I'm sorry Goober, I thought you had thrown out a teaser, just to see if anyone knew!

THe symbol has come to be called the Messianic Seal, and it indicates unity.

See:

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You can also read Wiki for other info. I am including some other sites I visited in looking for the info.
Again, thanks for the education!

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Thank you for sharing the info!

Did you learn what you had hoped to on this subject?

I'm still reading the material.

Here's a powerful quote.

Quote:

For the past 1700 years the Menorah has stood alone to represent the Torah and the Fish has been swimming on it’s own to represent Grace. In these miraculous days Abba is restoring His truth to His people and we are seeing the two become one in Messiah. We are to become one people, one body, and one faith. The Two Sticks of Ezekiel (Ez. 37) are to become one in the hand of the Lion of the Tribe of Judah. When Torah and Grace are in perfect balance they reveal the Star of David, the Son of David who is our Messiah and King.

There are SOOOO many Christians that do NOT want to hear this message and will use any means at their disposal to see that the Fish of grace continues to swim alone and out of balance. They ignore the fact that for the first 300 =/- years, this was not what Jesus, the Apostles, and the church fathers taught and believed.

Thank you again for sharing those links.

I am SO happy to have found them. Who can keep the truth they know/find to themselves? It is to be shared!
By the way, I have not read all of it either.

	Misfit wrote:
	I am SO happy to have found them. Who can keep the truth they know/find to themselves? It is to be shared! By the way, I have not read all of it either.

The hard part is not the sharing, but finding someone willing to listen.



I like much of this article, he articulates it very well.

Quote:

The Fish symbolizing Grace needs to be caught on the Hebraic roots of the faith. The swimming fish displayed by Christians is separated from the Jewishness of it’s Messiah. Fishers of men need to go forth and preach the gospel that will be received by the Jew first and then to the Gentile. Those who have been given the understanding of the Messianic Seal need to preach the good news of the Torah-Grace of God available to whosover will receive it. For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Messiah: for it is the power of Elohim unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek [Gentile] (Rom.1:16).

Quote:

Romans 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel of Christ: for it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth; to the Jew first, and also to the Greek. 2: 8 But unto them that are contentious, and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, indignation and wrath, 9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that doeth evil, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile; 10 But glory, honor, and peace, to every man that worketh good, to the Jew first, and also to the Gentile: 11 For there is no respect of persons with God. 12 For as many as have sinned without law shall also perish without law: and as many as have sinned in the law shall be judged by the law; 13 (For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.

This makes more sense now. Such a clear way of articulating that the same Gospel is for all people and that the Gospel is the same for all people and it includes the Torah. This is something I've known, but have been unable to even vaguely express it. The Sabbath matters.

Goober, I suspect you are correct that the Sabbath matters.

Here's the question I posed to my sons when they wanted to know why some go on Saturday and some on Sunday.

If you lived somewhere where there was no church or missionaries or other "Christianity/churching influence and you found the Bible laying on the ground; picked it up and read it from cover to cover; and believed that which you had read: what day of the week would you establish as your day of weekly convocation?

I pulled this from Kade's post.

Quote:

In the past, we have often pointed out the important meaning of Pentecost. To the Jews, it symbolizes the marriage contract between God and Israel at Sinai. On this date, Moses received the two tablets written in the Lord's own hand. This act initiated the Dispensation of Law. On Pentecost, religious Jews stay up all night studying Scripture, hoping for the blessing of a revelation from the Lord. This is exactly what the Apostles did on that most famous of all Pentecosts. Early the next morning, their revelation came, marking the birth of the church and the coming of the new Dispensation of Grace: "And when the day of Pentecost was fully come, they were all with one accord in one place. "And suddenly there came a sound from heaven as of a rushing mighty wind, and it filled all the house where they were sitting" (Acts 2:1,2).

Marriage, Law, and Grace were all with one accord in one place, and THEN came the Holy Spirit. Hmmm, very interesting.

It is interesting, especially in viewof the fact that when two Christians get together there is little to no accord.

I just noticed that Faith was not mentioned! That is foundation for any of it to mean anything, when it is bound with a right heart!! I will give the benefit of the doubt that the author just too them for such a given that any reader would also automatically understand and assume their includence or they are covered by the large issue of grace.